THANKS for doing that
A podcast CELEBRATING people and ideas that make this world a better place by exploring the things we do, the reasons we do them, and why IT MATTERS.
THANKS for doing that
Wendy and Colin Hornback on Faith, Food, Marriage, and Taxidermy?!?
Embark on a journey that challenges stereotypes as Wendy and Colin Hornback of Mission Taxidermy reveal the artistry and emotional depth behind hunting and taxidermy. These crafts preserve cherished memories and stories, reflecting the unique spirit of each animal. Their personal anecdotes transform the concept of mounts from mere trophies to meaningful symbols of shared experiences and God's intricate designs in nature.
Explore the ethical side of hunting with Wendy and Colin, who emphasize the importance of utilizing the whole animal. Learn about the nutritional benefits of often-overlooked organ meats like the heart and liver and the legal frameworks that support sustainable hunting practices across different states. Discover the fascinating challenges within taxidermy as they share their encounters with diverse creatures, from the tough skin of alligators to the unique features of the Barbary sheep.
Get inspired by the dynamic partnership of Wendy and Colin as they navigate business and marriage with strategies rooted in effective communication and collaboration. Their stories remind us of the satisfaction in aligning our lives with personal values and finding joy in the little things, like a well-deserved scoop of ice cream.
Catch more of the story @thanks.for.doing.that.podcast!
Hey, there you are listening to Thanks for Doing that a podcast celebrating people and ideas that make this world a better place. I am Heather Winchell, your host and chief enthusiast, and I'm on a mission to bring you conversations that encourage, inspire and delight. So stay tuned for another episode where we explore the things we do, the reasons we do them and why it matters. Today I'm joined by Wendy and Colin Hornbach of Mission Taxidermy and the Mission Mindset Podcast. So, full disclosure, I never saw myself hosting a Thanks for Doing that episode highlighting taxidermy. However, after listening to one of the episodes that Wendy and Colin put out on their podcast, I was actually really thankful for the way it reframed the what and the why of taxidermy. So there is a lot to say here, but I think we should just jump right in and talk about it together. So, wendy and Colin, it is my pleasure to welcome you to the podcast. Thank you so much for taking the time to join me today.
Speaker 2:Our pleasure. We're excited to be here, yeah.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, and let's kick off this conversation by giving the listeners some insight into the eclectic I think you guys call it unconventional flavor you guys are bringing into the podcast space and into your life mission.
Speaker 3:I think we started off in the unconventional realm when we first met. So you know, unconventional is kind of normal for us.
Speaker 2:It's kind of our thing. That's what we say on our podcast. Yeah, it's definitely, like I said, just I don't know more unique than a lot of stories I've heard. So, yeah, we kind of started off that way and just the way we met at work, and I grew up as a believer in a Christian household and Wendy grew up a little differently than I did and Wendy grew up a little differently than I did, so off the bat we started off as unconventional and never thought taxidermy would be a part of our lives.
Speaker 3:But here we are and it is a beautiful thing. We enjoy the stories. We enjoy seeing God's fingerprints all over the stories and animals that come into our shop, and it has been a fascinating thing from the get-go.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, I remember in the episode I listened to that you guys did, one of the things that really struck me was when you spoke to that, when you said that you really felt like not only are all of the stories of the animals coming in differently, but the animals themselves, even though you know I think you said it like a buffalo is a buffalo is a buffalo, but actually they're very different and their hair can be different, in their eyes and just the way different things are formed, and so actually that was one of the comments that was really striking and meaningful to me. I was like, oh yeah, just like every person, it's a little bit different. Every animal is too so.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they all are unique. You know antlers are all unique. The coloration is unique, to where they're. You know chipped and cracked and what they did, and you know scars on their face or their you know wherever, like it's all. It's all unique to that animal and there's there's never two that are the same, and so it's always really cool just to see the differences and the unique characteristics and, um, you know how we say, god's fingerprints are just like all over those things and it's just really cool to see.
Heather Winchell:Yeah. So in that same episode you guys kind of explained the how and why of Colin landing in taxidermy, and it sounds like you had the opportunity to get to know someone that was already doing taxidermy and then had your own assumptions reframed from the experience of working with them or observing them. So I would just yeah, I would love for you to tell us what are the common misconceptions about your field of work and how would you speak to those.
Speaker 3:Well, neither one of us grew up in hunting families and so our taxidermy viewpoint, I guess, or even hunting viewpoint, was largely shaped by Hollywood, and they always portray, you know, these dumb hunters out there slinging lead in the woods, and that's not the case at all these, you know there's a lot of like hard work and commitment and intentionality that goes into a hunt, and the reason behind all of that is the why, behind why somebody would want to have a mount. You know, maybe it's their kid's first hunt or their dad's last hunt. And taxidermy was always kind of the creepy guy in the you know dark, dingy like scary basement or you know shop like with inappropriate posters on the walls and things like that. That's this vision that I had, but it is very much an artwork.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for me, I'd say, a lot of misconceptions come that most people call it trophy hunting. It's totally a misnomer. It's not about the animal. In fact, what really reframed my beliefs and understanding of what taxidermy was, I took a job up in Wisconsin. We moved from Colorado to Wisconsin for a while. I worked in the outdoor industry there in a company called Vortex Optics and I was meeting a lot of hunters there and they'd have us over for dinner, you know just kind of welcoming us to the area and you know, to get to know us, and they'd show me their mounts on the wall that they had and every single story, different homes, different places, like they were always like. Well, that that was a special hunt Cause that was with my dad after a really tough season in my life. This deer is really important Cause I was with a buddy right before he got deployed and it was always, always a story about who they were with what was done, like a season in life.
Speaker 2:It was never about the size of the deer and so many people think in, you know, in Wisconsin is predominantly deer but so many people think it's about the size of the animal and so many people look at me and go like, oh, I'm not a trophy hunter, like, ooh, like mighty hunter, hear me roar, and like that's what people think of as like why people are having mounts done and I've I've just found that that is almost never the case. Like I, it's almost always a very unique, special time. Um it, you know, hunt, that was very difficult. It took a lot of preparation. It's remembering who, that who was there, uh, how that hunt went. It's a story on the wall.
Speaker 2:So we kind of come up with the, the saying that the, you know things are measured by inches and you know, for record books there are record books in taxidermy it's a thing, but we always say the inches are in the story, so it's not about the size of the animal. Um, you could, yeah, if your kid's first buck is a little forky, but that was super special and you're like honoring the memory of that kid's first experience harvesting his own animal field, dressing it himself and doing all that hard work, then it's worth a mount. If you want to, if that's something you have the money for and the inclination to do, it's special. Keep the memory of that alive. That kid's going to remember that forever. So just something that really reframed me was just the experience with these other hunters and how it wasn't about the size of an animal at all, it had nothing to do with that.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, you just used a term that I'm not familiar with.
Speaker 3:for key it's a little it's a little buck with really little antlers and they just split they, you know, in animal road. It's just a little tiny.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, um, antlers grow from you know, they they start to grow, um, and they, they basically add essentially a time like every year, um, more or less. So they, they grow and then they start to, you know, get a main branch and that thing splits off. So when they're really little and they're real fresh, probably like I don't know a year old, year and a half old, something like that they, they grow, these little, spindly little little antlers that come straight up and they just split on each side. So they call them a little like a forky buck, and so there's just a little teeny little buck. He's a little guy, but it's illegal and you can. You can harvest them If you have an opportunity.
Speaker 2:Most hunters are looking for something a little more mature, just due to the challenge of it. You know, it's not so much I want a giant animal, it's I want. I want to hunt, I want to experience, I want to. I it's I want. I want to hunt, I want to experience, I want to. I want to know that I did the work and I put in the effort to, I mean, really outsmart these animals on their turf because, like they're, they're the masters out there, like they can get around so much faster, better, quieter, you know they're.
Speaker 3:They don't get to be really big. You know, have these really big racks by standing in front of somebody by making mistakes.
Speaker 2:So if I help, smart that animal and, like you know, work to do the you know, do all the work and harvest that animal responsibly, ethically, legally, then it's an accomplishment and it's something special, and that's that's more what size has to do with it than just like, ooh, look at me, I'm awesome, I got the biggest thing out there. But it's just about the challenge and about the way it pushes you and makes you do more preparation, physically, mentally, with your scouting purposes, reviewing maps ahead of time, figuring out where to go, how to get there, what it's going to take to be in there and stay in there and to figure out where that animal is going to be. There's just so much work that goes into that and that's what is kind of special for people to remember.
Speaker 3:I think one of the other misconceptions is that it's just about the trophy on the wall, and that's not true. It's also about meat in freezer and I think more and more that's becoming more important of like knowing where your meals come from and things like that. And so you know, uh, an elk is obviously a very large animal and that provides a lot of meat, and we always try to do what we call like nose to tail, um, and and just eat as much of that animal as we can. We feel like that really honors the animal. And you know, knowing that we, um, we stewarded that animal to the best of our ability and didn't just take for granted. You know what it has provided, what God has provided for us in that.
Speaker 2:Speaking of that, that is another misconception that people think that when you mount an animal, there's a lot of the real animal in that mount and that you don't harvest the meat and that's. That's a hundred percent. Not true. You you actually harvest can harvest all the meat, um, from literally the back of the head, like the whole neck, all the way, all the way back. Anything that's edible you can take. All I'm using is the skin of the animal and, um, I use on antlered or horned animals. I use one little piece of the skull. It's called a skull cap and it's just this section of the skull that, uh, has the antlers connected to it, and that's all that I need. All the meat is taken and harvested and utilized for that hunter and that family to to use for sustenance over the course of a year or even a couple of years if it's a large animal.
Speaker 3:And even if you break down the word taxidermy, is it entomology? Is that right the entomology of it? Where you know, taxi is like to ride in, right, Like if you think about a taxi to move and dermis, is the skin right. So taxidermy is like moving the skin from the live animal to the form, moving it on the mannequin itself, aligning it correctly.
Heather Winchell:I never knew that.
Speaker 2:It's like a sock. If you put a sock on, you can put a sock on and the heel can be way up on the back of your ankle and that sock is not actually on correctly. You can do the same thing in taxidermy, putting things on and aligning it to the mannequin so that it looks like the right animal.
Heather Winchell:Right, yeah, yeah, I guess that would be a really interesting element to get right. I imagine you could have some some squirrely looking no pun intended animals. Yeah, yeah. Something you guys said brought a question to mind, but I just thought of a squirrely animal and so it totally floated out of my mind for a moment Um if you Google like bad taxidermy there there are some doozies.
Heather Winchell:Oh man, I can imagine I might have to Google that. It is helpful to hear you know, because we are not a hunting family and that's just that's not something I've ever been around much. But I do have many friends that you know in Colorado or in Texas do hunt and my experience has been that they all do harvest the animal and have the meat. Would you say that's most common that people are utilizing the whole animal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely People are. When people go out to hunt they're they're hunting to put meat in the freezer. There are. I say the predominant majority of them are trying to utilize as much of that animal as they can. Not everybody uses it as much as we do. We even like a lot of the organ meats, so we love so good for you.
Speaker 2:Like heart is an amazing cut that I I steered away from the first couple of years that I harvested animals. Um, somebody told me I should try it and I was like, well, try anything once, right. Like I mean, what's it going to cost me? Like, if I don't like it, I don't have to eat it again. So we tried it and I was like, oh my goodness, that that is nothing like what I had in mind of what heart would be, nothing Like I had no clue what I was missing out on and I was like I'll never leave a heart in the field again. Um, but even liver, we'll take the liver and a lot of times we I have a grinder to grind my own meat. I like to process all my own cuts in my own meat. So I a lot of times we even just cut it into chunks and grind it into ground meat. So you're not stuck eating like liver and onions because a lot of people are like ew it is.
Speaker 2:It's a very it's pretty potent taste and it's a texture. For a lot of people it's kind of a chalky texture with liver. They don't like it. But if you grind it in the ground meat you you really almost don't even notice it's there at all. It's very, very healthy, but it adds a lot of great nutrients to your meat that you don't get otherwise. So we like to utilize, like I said, as much of that animal as we possibly can. I mean I usually bring bones home and we make bone broth out of that too. So we're trying to utilize everything. When I'm done with an animal, I mean there is very little left in the field for the bugs and the birds to pick at, so something we'd like to do. Not everyone is going to utilize as much, but they do utilize all the legal requirements that there is a legal requirement here in Colorado.
Speaker 2:I don't know about every state, but usually this is the bare minimum from the States I know, and some States are more strict, but you have to take what they call all four quarters, meaning that the two front legs and shoulders, the two rear quarters, um so the rear legs and um, uh, hind quarters, up up. You know all the where the the biggest cuts are, the biggest main, yeah, meat cuts are um the back straps, the two like really long, like tubular shaped, uh, muscles that run down the main back, and the tenderloins. Those are your four, I'm sorry, your main requirements the four quarters, tenderloins, back traps, so essentially six main aspects that you have to take legally out of the field and if you don't, if you were found out, you would be cited and fined for that, like you would be in trouble for it.
Speaker 3:Then it's considered poaching and.
Speaker 2:Well, it's considered what they call wanton waste W-A-N-T-O-N. Wanton waste. It just means severe, severely wasteful. It's just, it's totally unethical. It's actually illegal. In other states it is more strict, where you, you legally cannot carry the head and the antlers out before you get the meat out. You, you are legally required to get every last bit of meat off of that animal before you ever take the head out.
Speaker 2:So, um, some States are that strict. So, again, when people think of it as like you're just shooting an animal to take a trophy, I'm not saying there aren't people that exist in the world that do that Um, they are, they're. They're called poachers? Um, they're, they're not. They're, they're called poachers, they're, they're not. They're not hunters. That's not hunting. Hunting is is following the legal aspects, the ethical aspects of of what it is to harvest an animal and responsibly get that meat home for consumption. And and if you want to bring home something that is a great reminder of that experience and who you were with, that's what the head, the hide, those things are for.
Heather Winchell:What is the most interesting mount you've worked on?
Speaker 2:man, that's a good question alligator, once an alligator, well it was the skin it was.
Speaker 3:It was just the skin, the tan skin but yeah, so that one was pretty interesting.
Speaker 2:Um, it's, those are crazy like you, man. They talk about their skin being like armor. I mean, a hundred percent is like armor. That is, that is some crazy stuff. Um, that's been interesting. There's, there's a type of sheep um down in like Texas, new Mexico. Um, it's called an odd ad or a Barbary sheep, um, so if you want to look those up, those are very unique animals. They're really really cool. Um very different, um somewhat similar like a horn kind of like a Rocky mountain big horn sheep, but where the Rocky mountain big horn sheep kind of circles around its head. These ones um kind of sort of poke more out the side and go down. Um, so they're just a very unique like a long horned, looking, uh looking animal, but very cool. Um. They're also really neat cause they have really short hair on their their like legs and their sides, but then on the front they have these they call them chaps. It's really long hair that runs down the front of their arms and the front of their legs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so they're they're just a really cool animal, um, very unique. Um, I really like those. Those are. They're just a lot of fun. They're just a different animal than like anything else, so I really liked them we think we like the unique aspects of the regular animals that come in too.
Speaker 3:So deer and antelope. We had one antelope, male antelope that had only had one horn, so we called him a unicorn. He just had this little nub and but only one horn that actually developed. And there are different I guess I would call them I don't know anomalies or abnormalities where you know an antler doesn't form correctly and it just kind of forms this like ball on top of their head and they call it like a club antler. So those are really interesting too. To again like a deer is a deer is a deer until it's not until you look really closely and realize it has uniqueness to it as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a friend harvested a deer and normally their antlers are kind of in the same spot on their heads. But this guy harvested a deer and one of them was like set down and more forward like quite a bit by quite a bit and it was just sort of like offset and it was really again just really unique way, different, just kind of cool, just different, different things about these animals. That stands out, they're kind of cool, just different, different things about these animals that stands out, they're kind of unique. And again, it's fun to see. You know, sometimes you see ones that were real fighters and you can just see all the scars on them.
Speaker 2:I've seen here come in that you can tell probably got a time like in fighting, like with each other. They took a time through their ear and it like literally ripped their ear in half and they they just deal with it, like they it heals and they they just kind of move on and heal up and go on and so they're just they're tough animals, they're, they're really cool. It's the the interesting things that, like the stories, you kind of go like I wonder what happened to this guy and like you know just what whatever you know made that thing happen that way? Or like why did that antelope only have one horn? Like why did it what? What happened to it? Did it get injured? Did it just have a genetic deficiency that it didn't grow? Like you don't know. But it's just fun to see and get to see them up close and pretend you figure out the I don't know. Not figure out, but like make up the stories in your head about what could happen with this animal. It's just kind of fun.
Heather Winchell:Something I really appreciate about what you're saying is just in the premise of you know understanding that each animal, though they're they kind of like from a distance maybe, look alike as you get closer, as you really see them, there's like a delight that comes in seeing the differences.
Heather Winchell:And it kind of reminds me. You know, I had an opportunity to live abroad. I spent some time living cross-culturally and the population that I lived amongst whenever I would talk about that population back home, people would say, like how can you tell them apart? They all look the same, which, in all fairness, I think whatever culture you're from, people from a different culture, it's like your first engagement. Maybe you don't see the subtleties and the differences as readily because you're just acclimating to. You look very different than me, your features are very different than me, but very similar to a lot of your population. But it is really cool and it's such an invitation into really seeing people, seeing animals and delighting in the differences and the nuances and, yeah, the ways that they're unique.
Speaker 2:It's really fun.
Heather Winchell:So another element of the mission mindset that you guys have is found in your podcast and, fun fact for the listeners, wendy and Colin previously both had their own successful podcasts but chose to move forward with a combined effort in their current offering. So you guys focus on marriage, cooking skills, business development and your faith. Tell me more.
Speaker 3:We both kind of were getting a little bit not tired of doing podcasts on our own, but we realized we had split focus and so we decided to kind of form more of an umbrella podcast together, I guess.
Speaker 3:And since our business name is Mission Taxidermy, we decided to call it Mission Mindset, because the name mission came from our mission to A debunk all of those snowmores, misconceptions about what taxidermy is and what hunting is, and also we're on mission for Christ. We want to serve him well, we want to keep him at the center, and so mission mindset really put an umbrella over our whole lives, from how we show up for each other, how we show up for our community, how we show up for our community, how we show up in our businesses and all of the things that we love to do too, like having a garden, cooking. One of the things that we say is we're passionate about sourcing our own ingredients and having a garden and hunting is part of that. So mission mindset really kind of mission mindset really kind of fit that overarching theme for our lives, and it's been great so far. It's not pressure to do something every single week, because I can do one one week, colin can do one another week we can have an interview with somebody.
Speaker 3:We can do one together, and that's selfishly a little bit of why we decided to kind of make that shift, but it also is more all-encompassing for us as a whole. And we want to do everything together instead of having that split focus, so it really worked out well for us to start it this way, or?
Speaker 2:kind of revamp it to be this way Wendy's podcast originally was From scratch cookery and talked a lot about the cooking side and gardening and things like that Kind of not exclusively, but kind of focused towards women. Mine was definitely focused towards men, mine was the discipline of manliness and really focused towards men and how we develop and our masculinity and show up in the role that God intended us to have. Um, and that was good and I liked that, but it just was, it just felt incomplete, like so we, we just felt like combining these efforts um would allow us to speak, to still speak to men, um, still speak to women and kind of get both audiences engaged and help people who are again maybe married or newly married or struggling with an aspect of marriage, and lets us kind of speak more holistically about our life together in marriage, in faith, in business, and just sort of really broadened up the. We felt like the topics that we could even talk about and how we could bring value and how we're you know we are.
Speaker 2:I think we say it in our intro that we're willing to talk kind of about what we call the messy middle of like look, it's not easy, like building a business. There are going to be times when you feel like this is going nowhere. What do we do, like, how do we overcome these challenges? And we're willing to share about those things. And, like I said, this is still relatively new, we're only even three or four episodes in but we're going to. We want to share about those things, you know, we want to be able to bring the holistic view of life, the pros, the things that we're winning in, the losses that we've experienced, the things that we failed in. Where we're at now, like this is, you know, not just to get on a mic and complain to anybody, but just say, like you know, this is the challenge and here's the aspects of what now I'm finding I have to consider to try to overcome this challenge. And so it just kind of helps bring a little more value, we feel, to the audiences that are listening.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, and you know, I just I really think that people appreciate having opportunity to learn from others. And you know, it's funny because I think, in very different spaces, you guys are kind of doing what Chip and Joanna Gaines have done and just really inviting people to be part of their lives holistically Right. Yeah, what Chip and Joanna Gaines have done and just really inviting people to be part of their lives holistically Right, Like they've they basically had a business that was fruitful and then, you know, there was like certain values and character that was behind that and then they just kind of like started moving into other spaces of of influence and invitation into their lives. So, yeah, it strikes me that that's what you guys are doing as well and I think it can, like you said, you know, I'm confident you're not just using the mic to, you know, gripe about your life. I'm I'm confident that you're using it to really invite people to see like, hey, if you're kind of feeling like, does anybody else struggle here, no, you're not the only person that struggles like other people struggle.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, I think that that can just be such a helpful reminder to people.
Speaker 3:So yeah, so thank you Also.
Heather Winchell:So fun that you guys do this together. I have a couple of times asked handsome man, if that's what I call my husband. I've said, hey, would you want to come on my podcast? And he's like Nope.
Speaker 2:Nope.
Heather Winchell:Um, we're very different in that way he's he's totally content to never be in front of a mic, which I still love him. But it's super fun that you guys do this together. But I do wonder is it hard to be spouses, podcast co-hosts and business partners Like can you give us your wisdom on navigating that? Well?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean. So for me there probably were, because we do have some similar interests. Like we are both good at photography, we both enjoy the creative aspect of designing and building websites. Not that we're like coders, but like the website we use is very easy, for I mean it's like a drag and drop anybody to use.
Speaker 2:Like, honestly, most people can figure this out, Like we're not like geniuses on coding by any means, but we're we can. We can use this website. It's pretty awesome. So anyway, um, we both had interests, I think, in some of that. And, um, for me, like, it just became obvious like Wendy really does have a good skillset and I would argue she's better at it even than I am, even though I enjoy it. So we found a good balance.
Speaker 2:It just and this is what it takes you have to kind of go into it, maybe bump into each other just a little bit, and then figure out like, oh, okay, here's how I can contribute to this and here's how you can contribute to this. And so for us, um, things like the website became, um, I'm going to do what we call like wireframe it. So I'm going to say, like for for mission taxidermy, here's content that I would really like in the website. Here's some, here's some basic verbiage that I'm looking for. And so I kind of spell these things out and say this is the general like information that I want there. Now you can take it. If you want to change some wording, refine it, make it sound better, do it like you, lay it out how you want to. Here's the generalized what we want in the different sections of the website.
Speaker 3:And then I love the like design and like visual aspect of all of that and so it's a lot of fun for me to put that element together after I kind of have you know what what he has. And then you know a lot of times like we'll go back and forth and kind of refine some of that verbiage and I'll I'll say, do we need these extra five words in there? And he says yes, because that speaks to the hunting community which I'm not super familiar with. But I think that back and forth is really good. Where we butt heads is being raised completely different. You know we have very different communication styles.
Heather Winchell:And.
Speaker 3:I think one of the keys in in business and in life, in in marriage, is being able to communicate and and, like quote unquote, argue in a way that is not blaming the other person, but just having that conversation and being open to listening, because a lot of people they're like I want my way, I know I'm right, I don't want to hear anything you have to say.
Speaker 3:And I think opening that line of communication and making it a safe place to even bring forward something that you're concerned about or disagree with is is something that we've really had to work on and we've really had to, um, like hash through a lot of just even some of the smallest things, and and we know how to approach each other. Now, after 10 years of marriage, we know how to come to one another and say, hey, I need to share this. I don't know exactly how to say it, it might come across bad, but hear me out, and then we can talk about it. And I think even saying that up front kind of prepares the other person to say, okay, I need to listen and not feel that take that as like abrasive and, and you know, then, yeah, immediately react with something that was like oh well, you upset me.
Speaker 2:Instead, just like how dare you say that to me, oh?
Speaker 3:like be able to listen and process it in a way that is productive, instead of just butting heads all the time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I I'd sort of add to those things by saying that I think some of the things that have helped me learn how to do this in both in life and in business together is one the concept of who, not how. So it's not that I always have to figure out how we're going to accomplish something, but who am I going to get involved in this to help us facilitate the success? And figuring out that it doesn't always have to be me that does those things. And it's okay for me to step back, and I find usually the more I step back, especially in the design elements, whatever I thought was going to look good, wendy usually comes up with something way better, and so that is.
Speaker 2:It's really helpful for me to begin to see and be like man. I never would have thought of that. That's awesome. Like how did you come up with this? This is sweet. So it's just like then, the more there's success there, the more you're like man. I don't. I mean, yeah, I like it, but I don't wanna do it because she comes up with better stuff than I do. Anyway.
Speaker 3:You kind of build that tribe.
Speaker 2:So the receiver, not in the sender. So I might think I said something, and if Wendy didn't receive that correctly, then my communication was poor and that's not her fault. That means I didn't communicate in a way that she understood what I was asking or what I was saying. So it's like, okay here, like here's what I really meant when I said that. How else could I have said that to you? That would have helped you understand what I was saying. And so it's not finding fault in the other person because my communication didn't come through to them in the way that they needed to receive it. So then it's me now figuring out as I communicate in the future, altering that to be like how does this person best understand or hear this communication and trying to deliver it to them in the way that is best for them, not what's best for me as the, as the sender.
Speaker 3:And we've had conversations like that of you know, I see that you're upset, yeah, how could I have said this better? And we've literally asked each other that, which which feels kind of weird. But at the same time, scenarios are probably going to come up again. If they've come up once, right, like there's like life repeats itself. So if we remember, three years down the road, when that scenario comes up again, then we're able to address it in a better way. Then we're able to address it in a better way, a more constructive way, so that you know we can communicate that in a in a more um, a kinder way and a more productive way, so that that recipient does understand what we're actually trying to say.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, I think that's really helpful. In communication is often the the key in really relationships being able to work well together. So that's a great thing to point out.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we've worked really hard at communication because we are very, very different in it.
Speaker 2:Yep, my family is very direct and like to the point and, like you know, upfront about stuff. And you know Wendy's family was a little more like, uh, you know, don't talk about these things, they can be controversial or offensive and um, just sweep it under the rug. You know, not their meaning to just like ignore things, but just it was like, well, you know, I don't want to upset the person, so they just kind of like didn't talk about it and so that was just very, very different and um, and very indirect.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah so where I'm like direct that to her could originally kind of feel abrasive, and where for her being indirect and being like trying to be soft and gentle around it, I'm like I didn't get. You were telling me that at all. Like what you? That's what you meant when you said this. Like I had. No, I didn't grasp that in the slightest. Like I'm just kind of a dumb redneck, so you got to be really upfront with me If I didn't grasp that in the slightest. Like I'm just kind of a dumb redneck, so you gotta be really upfront with me. If you didn't like it when I did X, y, z, like I just need you to tell me hey, like I didn't exactly I didn't love that Could, could you maybe do that differently next time? Oh yeah, okay, like I just didn't know.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, yeah. Can you think of a story or experience that helps you capture the why, when you reflect on what encourages you to keep going in these endeavors?
Speaker 3:I don't know if it's so much of a story or experience as it is a desire, because we love the autonomy of owning our own business businesses, even though it's hard and there's obviously elements of it that you know. Every, every job has something you don't love, and you know, when you have a small business, you wear all the hats, you're, you're marketing, you are accounting, you know all the things and I think the autonomy and the flexibility outweigh the things that we don't love about the business. So I think that might be more of the story or the experiences is yeah.
Speaker 2:Our lives, like I said, have always been kind of unconventional. Like I said, the way we met, the way well, I mean we met at work, so that's not too unconventional, but just a story of who we were, um, our backgrounds and different things unconventional. The way we got engaged unconventional. The businesses that we've started kind of unconventional. So we, we never really fit the mold and so it's like I just kind of learned over time, I, I don't really fit the general mold, like I, I'm not really made for a nine to five behind a desk and I, I, I sort of like fade and like just I mean it's like a slow death, like not to be dramatic about it, but like I mean it is, it's like I mean it's just like okay, like I feel like my mind is rotting, like I just get bored to death sitting behind a desk. I want to do something. I want to be more active and I don't want to just fit into the like, okay, just show up, give me my paycheck, deposit money into my 401k and then one day I'll retire and I'll finally get to do the things I want. Like I just don't, I don't want that in life. So my, like, my, why is like that autonomy to be able to live and do the things that I want to do, that make me come alive while I'm young enough to be able to do them, and so for me, like that's the thing that kind of keeps me going, is like I just know I don't fit that and I could go back to it and I'm sure I could like just choose to survive in that and live in that. If I really had to you know, things are really just got I don't know financially too demanding and we just had to make a living I would do it. Obviously I'm willing to do whatever needs to be done to help provide for my family and for my wife and everything in our needs.
Speaker 2:But I know that, like, if I also have the option to be able to choose to pursue my own passions and to really live life, even though it's risky and it's hard and it's way more challenging than just showing up at a job, I know that I'm going to ultimately enjoy that so much more and it's so much more rewarding to know that. You know, I'm just like hunting, like yeah, it's way harder to go out into the woods, find the animal, get an opportunity to harvest that animal to make an ethical shot. Now I have to dress it out, I have to bring it home, I have to process it up. That's way, way harder than going over to to the supermarket and buying some meat Like that's it's way, way harder.
Speaker 2:So same thing in life with with a business like it's way harder to do all of this and to make a successful business. But it is way more rewarding and it does give you a lot more of that autonomy and that freedom to make your own choices and to know that, man, I did the extra work and I managed to accomplish this despite the challenges. It just kind of shows you a little bit more who you are and what you've got in the tank. So I just enjoy those things. And that's a long answer, but that's a lot of the why behind why we're doing what we're doing.
Speaker 3:I feel like yours is way better than mine. Well, that's a lot of the why, behind why we're doing what we're doing.
Heather Winchell:I feel like yours is way better than mine. Well, that's great.
Speaker 2:It's not better, it's just different.
Heather Winchell:It sounds like you guys have really found alignment with your design and the things that you do best and the things you're putting your hands to, so that's really great, yeah. So, as I kind of close out our time together, I always like to ask my guests some fun questions, so I have some fun questions for you, okay, cool, okay. So if you had to be a married couple from any past or current TV show, what couple would you be and why? You know?
Speaker 3:we don't really know any like current TV shows actually have regular TV. Um, this is a really hard one, Maybe like the what is the couple from the Dick Van Dyke show? What are their names?
Speaker 2:Uh, isn't it Peter and Laura?
Speaker 3:Peter and Laura maybe just because we laugh a lot Like we're goofy. We have these like weird inside jokes that I'm a nerd. People would probably look at us like you are so weird. There was like a fly on the wall, so maybe maybe that like we, we, just we laugh a lot.
Speaker 2:I like that one and one show we do like that's a little more current. It's been off the air for a while now, but white collar Peter and Elizabeth Burt on white collar. Okay, it's one of the few TV shows where I feel like it's a really good marriage, like there's communication, there's understanding, there's support. There's disagreements, but still respect in those disagreements. There's a lot of good in their relationship and I like their relationship on that show a lot.
Heather Winchell:They're dynamic. Yeah, that's fun.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that might be one of my answers. I like that one a lot, but I definitely agree with the dick van dyke show, that's. That's very goofy sense of humors and I'm like I'm a nerd, so that's wonderful.
Heather Winchell:I, um, I can't. I've not seen white collar and it's been a long time since I've seen dick van dyke, so I might have to revisit just to kind of get a feel for that dynamic.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Heather Winchell:Okay, what unnecessary household item could you simply not live without?
Speaker 3:I love this question.
Speaker 2:I think we had two.
Speaker 3:We have two.
Speaker 2:That's fair, you're two people.
Speaker 3:One is our ice cream maker, Ooh okay. We love making homemade ice cream. We bought it several years ago on a Black Friday deal and I think if there was a fire we would probably race downstairs and try to get it to take it with us. That's so fun we really love our ice cream maker.
Speaker 2:That one's fun. And then, um, my gosh, what are they called? There's these great little like bag clips. They're like a little slider. It's like you, you like, take like a chip bag or um, or I mean, you can use not anything, you anything, but you fold it over in half and then slide this little tube thingy over the bag and it makes it airtight.
Speaker 3:Oh nice.
Speaker 2:They're super handy, it's called a grip stick, Grip stick yeah, and it's S-T-I-C.
Speaker 2:Grip stick. So super cool little device People can use them. Like if you have kids and you have like a little plastic bag you want to put like milk and Cheerios together, but obviously you don't want the Cheerios in the milk the whole time because they'll get soggy, you could pour the milk in the bottom and then you can put the grip stick thing over the over that and then you pour Cheerios into the part, the other, the top part, and then zip it shut and make your Ziploc bag and then when you're ready to have your kid eat out of that bag with a little spoon you just pull the grip stick off and then all the Cheerios will fall into the milk and then now you can eat your Cheerios and milk. But it's a handy little thing. I mean, that's just a hypothetical like if you needed it. For that we use it for a lot of things.
Speaker 2:They're awesome. They're totally unnecessary. There's other ways you could do this stuff, but they're an awesome little device and I really like these things. They're super handy, yeah.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, I mean honestly, like from both of those answers I'm thinking gosh, we probably need that, even though we don't. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's great 100%.
Heather Winchell:Okay, what are three words that describe your marriage?
Speaker 3:Oh boy Transparent.
Speaker 2:Quirky.
Speaker 3:And um transparent quirky and joyful, sure, so transparent, quirky, joyful. Yeah, sure, love it, I love it. We always try to be like I don't want to say brutally honest, because that sounds bad, but, um, we, we definitely honor honesty in our, our relationship. And it's definitely quirky, like we said a minute ago, but and we have a lot of joy. A lot of joy, not to say that there are hard times and frustrations are certainly are, but we have a lot of joy.
Heather Winchell:And what are three things that bring delight in this season?
Speaker 3:Well, it's fall right now, as we're recording this, um October 1st, so definitely, the changing of the season is certainly one thing for me I love it he's gonna say hunting well, obviously, I actually was thinking autonomy right now.
Speaker 2:um, we're not like our businesses aren't at a point where we're like making the money we probably need and want to make, but, um, we do. We do have some more freedom, uh, of tough time and that autonomy. So that's something that I'd say is is pretty, pretty awesome right now and I'm enjoying that, and, of course, I mean yeah, so wonderful.
Heather Winchell:Okay. So I'd now like to invite you to give your own shout out. Who would you want to tell Thanks for doing that, and why?
Speaker 3:this is a hard question because there's so many people doing so many amazing things. I think I would say either my friend Elizabeth, who is working so hard in our little community here to bring the community together, and my friend Stevie, who is incredibly loyal and has worked so hard at her current job. She is very mindful and very intentional about raising her son and the way that she shows up. She is just an incredible person Cool.
Speaker 2:I think one for me would be my friend Colin, not me, it's Colin with two L's.
Speaker 2:So if you can, tell you can say you know Colin versus Colin. So you know, anyways, my friend, uh, colin is a really good guy. He's um, he's got a few years on me and he's just a little more advanced in his um entrepreneurship journey and um, but he's someone who gets together with me now and then and asks how things are going and asks what our struggles are and how he can be praying for us and what advice could he give, and things like that. So he's someone who just pours into me and helps me figure out areas where I can get better and continue growing. So he's probably one of the ones that stands out to me initially.
Speaker 2:And then the other ones I can think of are, uh, some from friends and colleagues in in the taxidermy world. Um, I've got some friends down the road in Longmont at Colorado creations and uh, they're they're a really cool group of guys and uh, when I've been on hunts and things like that, they've backed me up and helped me to, you know, take care of some things. Or help Wendy take care of some things. You know, recently on a hunt and, uh, she ended up getting calls for two moose and a life-size mountain goat and she's like I have no idea what to do with these things.
Speaker 2:So they helped us out a lot. So there there are some guys that just, uh, they've had my back and been a really great support, even though I mean you could say we're competition, but we're, um, we're also friendly competition, and so they're. They've been really cool guys to help me out and hook me up when I needed some help.
Heather Winchell:Yeah, that's great. That's great. Well, the way I officially close out my episodes is by reading a personalized haiku that I have written for you, and it just is a way to say thank you and it's a way to capture why I invited you to join me today. So I'd like to do that now. That's great. Thanks for doing that, leveraging your life in a mission mindset.
Speaker 3:That's so perfect.
Heather Winchell:I love it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's so cool.
Speaker 3:You even got mission in there. That's great, that's awesome.
Heather Winchell:You are so welcome. It was such a joy to have you. Thanks for doing that is presented to you by the apiary a place for beholding and becoming, and thank you for joining us for today's episode. Before you go, I have a couple of invitations. If you found it meaningful, could I invite you to take two minutes to rate and review the show. But let's link arms to call out the good and beautiful that we see around us, because I really believe that finding delight in our divided and difficult world could make a real difference.